Thomas Jefferson - Memoir, Correspondence, And Miscellanies, From The Papers Of Thomas Jefferson

T >> Thomas Jefferson >> Memoir, Correspondence, And Miscellanies, From The Papers Of Thomas Jefferson

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your friend and servant,

Th: Jefferson.

LETTER LXVI.--TO WILLIAM CARMICHAEL, June 22, 1785

TO WILLIAM CARMICHAEL.

Paris, June 22, 1785.

Sir,

Your letter of April the 4th came to my hands on the 16th of that month,
and was acknowledged by mine of May the 3rd. That which you did me the
honor to write me on the 5th of April, never came to hand until the 19th
of May, upwards of a month after the one of the day before. I have hopes
of sending the present by a Mr. Jarvis, who went from hence to Holland
some time ago. About this date, I suppose him to be at Brussels, and
that from thence he will inform me, whether, in his way to Madrid, he
will pass by this place. If he does, this shall be accompanied by a
cipher for our future use; if he does not, I must still await a safe
opportunity. Mr. Jarvis is a citizen of the United States from New-York,
a gentleman of intelligence, in the mercantile line, from whom you will
be able to get considerable information of American affairs. I think
he left America in January. He informed us that Congress were about to
appoint a Mr. Lambe, of Connecticut, their consul to Morocco, and to
send him to their ministers, commissioned to treat with the Barbary
powers, for instructions. Since that, Mr. Jay enclosed to Mr. Adams,
in London, a resolution of Congress deciding definitively on amicable
treaties with the Barbary States, in the usual way, and informing him
that he had sent a letter and instructions to us, by Mr. Lambe. Though
it is near three weeks since we received a communication of this from
Mr. Adams, yet we hear nothing further of Mr. Lambe. Our powers of
treating with the Barbary States are full, but in the amount of the
expense we are limited. I believe you may safely assure them, that they
will soon receive propositions from us, if you find such an assurance
necessary to keep them quiet. Turning at this instant to your letter
dated April 5th, and considering it attentively, I am persuaded it must
have been written on the 5th of May: of this little mistake I ought to
have been sooner sensible. Our latest letters from America are of the
middle of April, and are extremely barren of news. Congress had not yet
proposed a time for their recess, though it was thought a recess would
take place. Mr. Morris had retired, and the treasury was actually
administered by commissioners. Their land-office was not yet opened.
The settlements at Kaskaskia, within the territory ceded to them by
Virginia, had prayed the establishment of a regular government, and they
were about sending a commissioner to them. General Knox was appointed
their secretary of the war-office. These, I think, are the only facts
we have learned which are worth communicating to you. The inhabitants
of Canada have sent a sensible petition to their King, praying the
establishment of an Assembly, the benefits of the _habeas corpus_
laws, and other privileges of British subjects. The establishment of an
Assembly is denied, but most of their other desires granted. We are now
in hourly expectation of the arrival of the packet which should have
sailed from New York in May. Perhaps that may bring us matter which may
furnish the subject of a more interesting letter.

In the mean time, I have the honor to be, with the highest respect, Sir,

your most obedient

and most humble servant,

Th: Jefferson.

P.S. July 14. I have thus long waited, day after day, hoping to hear
from Mr. Jarvis, that I might send a cipher with this: but now give up
the hope. No news yet of Mr. Lambe. The packet has arrived, but brings
no intelligence, except that it is doubtful whether Congress will
adjourn this summer. The Assembly of Pennsylvania propose to suppress
their bank on principles of policy. T.J.

LETTER LXVII.--TO JOHN ADAMS, June 23, 1785

TO JOHN ADAMS.

Paris, June 23, 1785.

Dear Sir,

My last to you was of the 2nd instant, since which I have received
yours of the 3rd and 7th. I informed you in mine of the substance of our
letter to Baron Thulemeyer: last night came to hand his acknowledgment
of the receipt of it. He accedes to the method proposed for signing,
and has forwarded our despatch to the King. I enclose you a copy of
our letter to Mr. Jay, to go by the packet of this month. It contains a
statement of our proceedings since the preceding letter, which you
had signed with us. This statement contains nothing but what you had
concurred with us in; and, as Dr. Franklin expects to go early in July
to America, it is probable that the future letters must be written by
you and myself. I shall therefore take care that you be furnished with
copies of every thing which comes to hand on the joint business.

What is become of this Mr. Lambe? I am uneasy at the delay of that
business, since we know the ultimate decision of Congress. Dr. Franklin,
having a copy of the _Corps Diplomatique_, has promised to prepare a
draught of a treaty to be offered to the Barbary States: as soon as he
has done so, we will send it to you for your corrections. We think it
will be best to have it in readiness against the arrival of Mr. Lambe,
on the supposition that he may be addressed to the joint ministers for
instructions.

I asked the favor of you in my last, to choose two of the best London
papers for me; one of each party. The Duke of Dorset has given me leave
to have them put under his address, and sent to the office from which
his despatches come. I think he called it Cleveland office, or Cleveland
lane, or by some such name; however, I suppose it can easily be known
there. Will Mr. Stockdale undertake to have these papers sent regularly,
or is this out of the line of his business? Pray order me also any
really good pamphlets that come out from time to time, which he will
charge to me.

I am, with great esteem, dear Sir,

your friend and servant,

Th: Jefferson.

LETTER LXVIII.--TO COLONEL MONROE, July 5, 1785

TO COLONEL MONROE.

Paris, July 5, 1785.

Dear Sir,

I wrote you, by Mr. Adams, May the 11th, and by Mr. Otto, June the 17th.
The latter acknowledged the receipt of yours of April the 12th, which is
the only one come to hand of later date than December the 14th. Little
has occurred since my last. Peace seems to show herself under a more
decided form. The Emperor is now on a journey to Italy, and the two
Dutch Plenipotentiaries have set out for Vienna; there to make an
apology for their State having dared to fire a gun in defence of her
invaded rights: this is insisted on as a preliminary condition. The
Emperor seems to prefer the glory of terror to that of justice; and,
to satisfy this tinsel passion, plants a dagger in the heart of every
Dutchman which no time will extract. I inquired lately of a gentleman
who lived long at Constantinople, in a public character, and enjoyed the
confidence of that government, insomuch, as to become well acquainted
with its spirit and its powers, what he thought might be the issue of
the present affair between the Emperor and the Porte. He thinks the
latter will not push matters to a war; and, if they do, they must fail
under it. They have lost their warlike spirit, and their troops cannot
be induced to adopt the European arms. We have no news yet of Mr. Lambe;
of course our Barbary proceedings are still at a stand.*

[* The remainder of this letter is in cipher, to which there is no key
in the Editor's possession.]

Yours affectionately,

Th: Jefferson

LETTER LXIX.--TO MRS. SPROWLE, July 5,1785

TO MRS. SPROWLE.

Paris, July 5,1785.

Madam,

Your letter of the 21st of June, has come safely to hand. That which you
had done me the honor of writing before, has not yet been received. It
having gone by Dr. Witherspoon to America, which I had left before his
return to it, the delay is easily accounted for.

I wish you may be rightly informed that the property of Mr. Sprowle is
yet unsold. It was advertised so long ago, as to found a presumption
that the sale has taken place. In any event, you may safely go to
Virginia. It is in the London newspapers only, that exist those mobs and
riots, which are fabricated to deter strangers from going to America.
Your person will be sacredly safe, and free from insult. You can best
judge from the character and qualities of your son, whether he may be
an useful co-adjutor to you there. I suppose him to have taken side with
the British, before our Declaration of Independence; and, if this was
the case, I respect the candor of the measure, though I do not its
wisdom. A right to take the side which every man's conscience approves
in a civil contest, is too precious a right, and too favorable to the
preservation of liberty, not to be protected by all its well informed
friends. The Assembly of Virginia have given sanction to this right
in several of their laws, discriminating honorably those who took
side against us before the Declaration of Independence, from those
who remained among us, and strove to injure us by their treacheries.
I sincerely wish that you, and every other to whom this distinction
applies favorably, may find, in the Assembly of Virginia, the good
effects of that justice and generosity, which have dictated to them
this discrimination. It is a sentiment which will gain strength in their
breasts, in proportion as they can forget the savage cruelties committed
on them, and will, I hope, in the end, reduce them to restore the
property itself, wherever it is unsold, and the price received for it,
where it has been actually sold.

I am, Madam,

your very humble servant,

Th: Jefferson.

LETTER LXX.--TO JOHN ADAMS, July 7, 1785

TO JOHN ADAMS.

Paris, July 7, 1785.

Dear Sir,

This will accompany a joint letter enclosing the draft of a treaty? and
my private letter of June 23rd, which has waited so long for a private
conveyance. We daily expect from the Baron Thulemeyer the French column
for our treaty with his sovereign. In the mean while, two copies are
preparing with the English column, which Dr. Franklin wishes to sign
before his departure, which will be within four or five days. The
French, when received, will be inserted in the blank columns of each
copy. As the measure of signing at separate times and places is new, we
think it necessary to omit no other circumstance of ceremony which can
be observed. That of sending it by a person of confidence, and invested
with a character relative to the object, who shall attest our signature,
yours in London, and Baron Thulemeyer's at the Hague, and who shall make
the actual exchanges, we think will contribute to supply the departure
from the original form, in other instances. For this reason, we have
agreed to send Mr. Short on this business, to make him a secretary _pro
hac vice_, and to join Mr. Dumas for the operations of exchange, &c. As
Dr. Franklin will have left us before Mr. Short's mission will commence,
and I have never been concerned in the ceremonials of a treaty, I will
thank you for your immediate information as to the papers he should be
furnished with from hence. He will repair first to you in London, thence
to the Hague, and then return to Paris.

What has become of Mr. Lambe? Supposing he was to call on the
commissioners for instructions, and thinking it best these should be in
readiness, Dr. Franklin undertook to consult well the Barbary treaties
with other nations, and to prepare a sketch which we should have sent
for your correction. He tells me he has consulted those treaties, and
made references to the articles proper for us, which, however, he will
not have time to put into form, but will leave them with me to reduce.
As soon as I see them, you shall hear from me. A late conversation with
an English gentleman here, makes me believe, what I did not believe
before; that his nation thinks seriously that Congress have no power to
form a treaty of commerce. As the explanations of this matter, which you
and I may separately give, may be handed to their minister, it would be
well that they should agree. For this reason, as well as for the hope of
your showing me wherein I am wrong, and confirming me where I am right,
I will give you my creed on the subject. It is contained in these four
principles. By the Confederation, Congress have no power given them,
in the first instance, over the commerce of the States. But they have
a power given them of entering into treaties of commerce, and these
treaties may cover the whole field of commerce, with two restrictions
only. 1. That the States may impose equal duties on foreigners as
natives: and 2. That they may prohibit the exportation or importation of
any species of goods whatsoever. When they shall have entered into such
treaty, the superintendence of it results to them; all the operations
of commerce, which are protected by its stipulations, come under their
jurisdiction, and the power of the States to thwart them by their
separate acts, ceases. If Great Britain asks, then, why she should enter
into treaty with us? why not carry on her commerce without treaty? I
answer; because till a treaty is made, no consul of hers can be received
(his functions being called into existence by a convention only, and the
States having abandoned the right of separate agreements and treaties);
no protection to her commerce can be given by Congress; no cover to
it from those checks and discouragements, with which the States will
oppress it, acting separately, and by fits and starts. That they will
act so till a treaty is made, Great Britain has had several proofs; and
I am convinced those proofs will become general. It is then to put her
commerce with us on systematical ground, and under safe cover, that it
behoves Great Britain to enter into treaty. And I own to you, that my
wish to enter into treaties with the other powers of Europe, arises more
from a desire of bringing all our commerce under the jurisdiction of
Congress, than from any other views. Because, according to my idea, the
commerce of the United States with those countries not under treaty with
us, is under the jurisdiction of each State separately; but that of
the countries which have treated with us, is under the jurisdiction of
Congress, with the two fundamental restraints only, which I have before
noted.

I shall be happy to receive your corrections of these ideas, as I have
found, in the course of our joint services, that I think right when I
think with you.

I am, with sincere affection, Dear Sir,

your friend and servant,

Th: Jefferson.

P.S. Monsieur Houdon has agreed to go to America to take the figure of
General Washington. In the case of his death, between his departure from
Paris and his return to it, we may lose twenty thousand livres. I ask
the favor of you to inquire what it will cost to ensure that sum on his
life, in London, and to give me as early an answer as possible, that
I may order the ensurance, if I think the terms easy enough. He is, I
believe, between thirty and thirty-five years of age, healthy enough,
and will be absent about six months. T.J.

LETTER LXXI.--TO GENERAL WASHINGTON, July 10, 1785

TO GENERAL WASHINGTON.

Paris, July 10, 1785.

Dear Sir,

Mr. Houdon would much sooner have had the honor of attending you,
but for a spell of sickness, which long induced us to despair of his
recovery, and from which he is but recently recovered. He comes now, for
the purpose of lending the aid of his art to transmit you to posterity.
He is without rivalship in it, being employed from all parts of Europe
in whatever is capital. He has had a difficulty to withdraw himself from
an order of the Empress of Russia; a difficulty, however, that arose
from a desire to show her respect, but which never gave him a moment's
hesitation about his present voyage, which he considers as promising
the brightest chapter of his history. I have spoken of him as an artist
only; but I can assure you also, that, as a man, he is disinterested,
generous, candid, and panting after glory: in every circumstance
meriting your good opinion. He will have need to see you much while he
shall have the honor of being with you; which you can the more freely
admit, as his eminence and merit give him admission into genteel
societies here. He will need an interpreter. I suppose you could procure
some person from Alexandria, who might be agreeable to yourself, to
perform this office. He brings with him one or two subordinate workmen,
who of course will associate with their own class only.

On receiving the favor of your letter of February the 25th, I
communicated the plan for clearing the Potomac, with the act of
Assembly, and an explanation of its probable advantages, to Mr. Grand,
whose acquaintance and connection with the monied men here, enabled him
best to try its success. He has done so; but to no end. I enclose
you his letter. I am pleased to hear in the mean time, that the
subscriptions are likely to be filled up at home. This is infinitely
better, and will render the proceedings of the company much more
harmonious. I place an immense importance to my own country, on this
channel of connection with the new western States. I shall continue
uneasy till I know that Virginia has assumed her ultimate boundary to
the westward. The late example of the State of Franklin separating from
North Carolina, increases my anxieties for Virginia.

The confidence you are so good as to place in me, on the subject of the
interest lately given you by Virginia in the Potomac company, is very
flattering to me. But it is distressing also, inasmuch as, to deserve
it, it obliges me to give my whole opinion. My wishes to see you made
perfectly easy, by receiving, those just returns of gratitude from our
country to which you are entitled, would induce me to be contented with
saying, what is a certain truth, that the world would be pleased with
seeing them heaped on you, and would consider your receiving them as no
derogation from your reputation. But I must own that the declining them
will add to that reputation, as it will show that your motives have
been pure and without any alloy. This testimony, however, is not wanting
either to those who know you, or who do not. I must therefore repeat,
that I think the receiving them will not, in the least, lessen the
respect of the world, if from any circumstances they would be convenient
to you. The candor of my communication will find its justification, I
know, with you.

A tolerable certainty of peace leaves little interesting in the way of
intelligence. Holland and the emperor will be quiet. If any thing is
brewing, it is between the latter and the Porte. Nothing in prospect as
yet from England. We shall bring them, however, to a decision, now that
Mr. Adams is received there. I wish much to hear that the canal through
the Dismal Swamp is resumed.

I have the honor to be, with the highest respect and esteem,

Dear Sir, your most obedient

and most humble servant,

Th: Jefferson.

LETTER LXXII.--TO THE GOVERNOR OF VIRGINIA, July 11, 1785

TO THE GOVERNOR OF VIRGINIA.

Paris, July 11, 1785.

Sir,

Mr. Houdon's long and desperate illness has retarded, till now, his
departure for Virginia. We had hoped, from our first conversations with
him, that it would be easy to make our terms, and that the cost of
the statue and expense of sending him, would be but about a thousand
guineas. But when we came to settle this precisely, he thought himself
obliged to ask vastly more insomuch, that, at one moment, we thought
our treaty at an end. But unwilling to commit such a work to an inferior
hand, we made nim an ultimate proposition on our part. He was as much
mortified at the prospect of not being the executor of such a work, as
we were, not to have it done by such a hand. He therefore acceded to our
terms; though we are satisfied he will be a considerable loser. We were
led to insist on them, because, in a former letter to the Governor,
I had given the hope we entertained of bringing the whole within one
thousand guineas. The terms are twenty-five thousand livres, or one
thousand English guineas (the English guinea being worth twenty-five
livres) for the statue and pedestal. Besides this, we pay his expenses
going and returning, which we expect will be between four and five
thousand livres: and if he dies on the voyage, we pay his family ten
thousand livres. This latter proposition was disagreeable to us; but
he has a father, mother, and sisters, who have no resource but in his
labor: and he is himself one of the best men in the world. He therefore
made it a _sine qua non_, without which all would have been off. We have
reconciled it to ourselves, by determining to get insurance on his life
made in London, which we expect can be done for five per cent.; so that
it becomes an additional sum of five hundred livres. I have written
to Mr. Adams to know, for what per cent, the insurance can be had. I
enclose you, for a more particular detail, a copy of the agreement.
Dr. Franklin, being on his departure, did not become a party to the
instrument, though it has been concluded with his approbation. He was
disposed to give two hundred and fifty guineas more, which would have
split the difference between the actual terms and Mr Houdon's demand.
I wish the State, at the conclusion of the work, may agree to give him
this much more; because I am persuaded he will be a loser, which I
am sure their generosity would not wish. But I have not given him the
smallest expectation of it, choosing the proposition should come from
the State, which will be more honorable. You will perceive by the
agreement, that I pay him immediately 8333 1/3 livres, which is to be
employed in getting the marble in Italy, its transportation, he. The
package and transportation of his stucco to make the moulds, will
be about five hundred livres. I shall furnish him with money for his
expenses in France, and I have authorized Dr. Franklin, when he arrives
in Philadelphia, to draw on me for money for his other expenses, going,
staying, and returning. These drafts will have been made probably,
and will be on their way to me, before you receive this, and with the
payments made here, will amount to about five thousand livres more than
the amount of the bill remitted me. Another third, of 8333 1/3 livres,
will become due at the end of the ensuing year.

Dr. Franklin leaves Passy this morning. As he travels in a litter, Mr.
Houdon will follow him some days hence, and will embark with him for
Philadelphia. I am in hopes he need not stay in America more than a
month.

I have the honor to be, with due respect,

your Excellency's most obedient

and most humble servant,

Th: Jefferson.

[Illustration: Suggested Packet Project, page251]

LETTER LXXIII.--TO THE PRESIDENT OF CONGRESS, July 12, 1785

TO THE PRESIDENT OF CONGRESS.

(Private.) Paris, July 12, 1785.

Dear Sir,

I was honored, two days ago, with yours of May the 16th, and thank you
for the intelligence it contained, much of which was new to me. It
was the only letter I received by this packet, except one from Mr.
Hopkinson, on philosophical subjects. I generally write about a dozen
by every packet, and receive sometimes one, sometimes two, and sometimes
ne'er a one. You are right in supposing all letters opened which come
either through the French or English channel, unless trusted to a
passenger. Yours had evidently been opened, and I think I never
received one through the post office which had not been. It is
generally discoverable by the smokiness of the wax, and faintness of
the re-impression. Once they sent me a letter open, having forgotten
to re-seal it. I should be happy to hear that Congress thought of
establishing packets of their own between New York and Havre; to send a
packet from each port once in two months. The business might possibly be
done by two packets, as will be seen by the following scheme, wherein we
will call the two packets A and B.

January, A sails from New York, B from Havre. February. March. B sails
from New York, A from Havre. April. May. A sails from New York, B
from Havre. June. July. B sails from New York, A from Havre. August.
September. A sails from New York, B from Havre. October. November. B
sails from New York, A from Havre. December.

I am persuaded that government would gladly arrange this method with us,
and send their packets in the intermediate months, as they are tired of
the expense. We should then have a safe conveyance every two months, and
one for common matters every month. A courier would pass between this
and Havre in twenty-four hours. Could not the surplus of the post office
revenue be applied to this? This establishment would look like the
commencement of a little navy; the only kind of force we ought to
possess. You mention that Congress is on the subject of requisition. No
subject is more interesting to the honor of the States. It is an opinion
which prevails much in Europe, that our government wants authority to
draw money from the States, and that the States want faith to pay their
debts. I shall wish much to hear how far the requisitions on the States
are productive of actual cash. Mr. Grand informed me, the other day,
that the commissioners were dissatisfied with his having paid to this
country but two hundred thousand livres, of the four hundred thousand
for which Mr. Adams drew on Holland; reserving the residue to replace
his advances and furnish current expenses. They observed that these last
objects might have been effected by the residue of the money in Holland,
which was lying dead. Mr. Grand's observation to me was, that Mr.
Adams did not like to draw for these purposes, that he himself had
no authority, and that the commissioners had not accompanied their
complaints with any draft on that fund; so that the debt still remains
unpaid, while the money is lying dead in Holland. He did not desire me
to mention this circumstance; but should you see the commissioners, it
might not be amiss to communicate it to them, that they may take any
measures they please, if they think it proper to do any thing in it. I
am anxious to hear what is done with the States of Vermont and Franklin.
I think that the former is the only innovation on the system of April
23rd, 1784, which ought ever possibly to be admitted. If Congress are
not firm on that head, our several States will crumble to atoms by the
spirit of establishing every little canton into a separate State. I hope
Virginia will concur in that plan as to her territory south of the Ohio;
and not leave to the western country to withdraw themselves by force,
and become our worst enemies instead of our best friends.